A short introduction and Yin yoga questions

[YogiBalance]

First of all, i would like to thank you bernie for your very informative instructional videos and this website, especially the asanas page. I learn a lot from them. I have scoliosis and sciatica pains in background, i was doing strictly ashtanga poses which i learned about 10 years ago in a class i was going to, for several years (on and off through this 10 year period) and i was not feeling like i'm making progress, quite the opposite, i felt like i'm going backward to the point i did some really wrong movements in some poses that led me to having severe pains, especially when standing on my right feet where my sciatica radiates, and especially in the morning when waking up. I discovered your youtube channel and through it your website, about i think 2 months ago. I started practicing according to your instructions. I bought a long bolster and 2 standard wooden blocks. I feel a big improvement in my practice, balance, relaxation, like someone oiled my bones. Its like i reversed my spine health to 10 years ago. A lot of times i don't even feel pain anymore in my spine, a right shoulder pain i was feeling is just gone, i feel a sigh of relief in my breathing throughout the day, When waking up in the morning i don't feel stiff as before, i started sitting in close to squat position when using my computer for hours and i don't feel the strain i used to feel, my posture got my better, when sitting i learned to hang my neck on my hands for some of the time, among other things... I can't believe i only discovered yin yoga recently after knowing some things about yoga for these 10 years. I feel like yin side is the method that is more suitable for my body or the method my body needed in addition.
I have a few questions:
1. Is it recommended to do yang and yin style poses in the same practice?
2. Is it ok to do sphinx/seal+downdog or cobra/half cobra+downdog (yang style) as a contra pose filler between each yin pose? Like doing up+down dog as fillers in ashtanga for example?
3. Should i initiate inhale and exhale and trigger the groin and stomach muscles like in ashtanga in any of the yin poses? I find not initiating breathing and triggering muscles very relaxing in yin.
4. My body is just not flexible enough to do sitting poses flat on the mat. Is it better to do sitting poses on a low level chair/a few pillows on the ground or better in a reclining position (lying the back and head on a bolster instead of sitting on the butt) when doing caterpillar, half butterfly, etc. poses?
5. When sitting on a bolster or a bolster with a pillow above it i feel like my butt is sliding forward, i don't feel grounded to the mat. What would be a good setting for rising and grounding the core for sitting positions?

Thanks in advance,
Greetings,

[Bernie]

Welcome to the Forum!

1) The question of combining Yin and Yang postures has been addressed several times in the Forum. I would suggest you read these threads:

YinYang class
Yin before or after yang?
A Yin/Yang Fusion flow


2) Doing a short yang posture (30 seconds?) between yin poses is okay, as long as it is not a really strenuous/muscular pose.

3) Relax! This is yin. Don’t fret over breathing and engaging etc. We want to go past the muscles into the deeper connective tissues, so contracting the muscles is counterproductive.

4) Do what you can do! Don’t force anything. Experiment and listen to your body more than a guy typing on the internet. Use props. If you are still confused or struggling, go find a teacher who can watch you and offer persona guidance. (Here is a post and nice video on using props in Yin Yoga.)

5) As in #4, I would have to see you to know what to suggest. Find a local teacher and let her/him observe you.

Cheers!
Bernie

[YogiBalance]

1. What kind of connective tissues yin yoga poses strain? Every part of the body contains different kinds of connective tissues including our internal organs...
2. Do yin (and yang?) poses put strain on connective tissues not related to the specific tissue that is being strained like putting additional strain on the aorta connective tissue? Marfan syndrome patients (a genetic connective tissue disorder someone i know has) should avoid vigorous exercises like lifting weights, fast sprints, etc. because of the risk that such vigorous exercises might stretch the aorta and eventually might cause aneurysm. Though, certain exercises are very much recommended to marfan patients to do as a part of maintaining a healthy life style and strengethening the body. Gentle yoga poses and especially yin seem very safe to do, the American Heart Association has no recommendation that marfan patients should avoid yoga practice and also his doctor has no objection to exercise in a non vigorous way. More info about marfan dyndrome here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marfan_sy ... l_activity
What would be your opinion about this?

[Bernie]

The fascia of our body is like a 3-dimensional body stocking wrapping and enveloping all tissues, including the organs. I do not believe you can move or stretch one area in isolation from the rest of the body. So, every move we make, we stress all kinds of tissues...not just close to where the movement was initiated but also in areas far away, yes--including our organs. The real question is -- is this stress healthy or too much for these areas of the body? We can't say hypothetically, because everybody's body is unique, with its own unique biology and biography. Is it right for you? That is the investigation to undertake: through some theory and lots of practice.

Is your concern regarding Marfan Syndrome for you personally, or for someone you know, or more academic? If you are concerned, you may find an article I wrote on Yin Yoga and Hypermobility of interest. Let me know of your thoughts.

Cheers
Bernie

[YogiBalance]

I read it now. Nice to see a yoga article that mentions marfan syndrome.
"avoid sustained end of range motion", "The student is encouraged to linger at the edge, but not seek greater depth.". I find these lines important reminders.
I don't think that i'm even near the end of range of motion in any of the poses i do but i will keep reminding myself to let go of my ego.
Yeah, Marfan too affects each person differently.
My concern regarding marfan is for me and for others i know.
My conclusion so far after doing yang yoga for several years intermittently is that yoga is safe for me if done in a more gentle way, and that i need to be gentle especially with yang poses, not to do them vigorously like traditional ashtanga and i find yin to be generally more suitable than yang but of course i always listen to my body and i don't think that doing yin only is good for me. I just need to do things more gently and not to try to break records, to progress slowly. Moreover, not less important, i try to limit or avoid poses with the head upside down to avoid potentially elevated eye pressure. Aside of that, for my heart and aorta i do eco cardiogram every half a year and MRI every 5 years and for my eyes i visit my ophthalmologist every half a year to make sure everything is in good static shape. So far so good!
1. How can i know the end of range of motion for each the different poses?
2. Is it appropriate to feel a stretch pain during a pose/after it?
3. Is there a way to distinguish a good stretch from a bad one?

I know to identify 2 types of pains that i should not feel (correct me if i'm wrong), sharp pains and a feeling that someone is trying to attach electricity to my skin.

[Bernie]

Okay...all that is good to know. Now, I am going to give you another reading assignment to help you know when you've gone too far in a pose. Please read this article Good Pain, Bad Pain

Cheers!

[YogiBalance]

Thanks. I'm starting to figure out if in some poses i go too deep and the types of pain that i want or don't want to feel. In some days i feel a pain even the morning after the practice and in other days i feel less pain or even no pain for some time. My intention is to feel the least pain possible or ideally no pain at all outside of the practice. I feel unpleasant pain in sphinx pose so i maybe going too deep. i'll try to go less deep in the poses when i feel unpleasant sensations or modify them and see how i feel. I'm excited exploring, feeling and investigating all this.

[YogiBalance]

A new question.
I do the sphinx pose as a part of my daily practice and i feel the urge to bring my legs towards my buttocks but it seems my body is still not flexible enough for sphinx pose with raised legs because of unpleasant sensations so i just put my body and chin back on the mat and grabbed my feet and bent them towards my buttocks era with both hands and it felt pretty good (chin ,body, and quads stayed on the mat). It felt pretty yin as my hands stayed grabbed to my feet pretty effortlessly.
1. Could this kind of pose be done as preliminary yin pose before attempting sphinx with raised legs again or just as a yin pose by itself? If so, how should i do this pose the right way? Just the chin, body and quads on the mat, hands grabbing the feet to the buttocks while the whole body is relaxed?
2. Could it be also a good preliminary pose for bow pose (Dhanurasana) as well?
3. Another thing i noticed, my buttocks and hips area tend to rise up, it does not feel unpleasant but is it normal? Would it be a good idea to put some weight on them to increase the stretch?

[Bernie]

Re #1: I am not sure what you mean by “sphinx pose with raised legs”…Sphinx doesn’t raise the legs: they should be straight and relaxed on the floor. There is an option where you bend the knees and bring the heels to the butt. Is that what you mean? If you can’t use your legs muscles to lift the shins off the floor, no problem, holding the feet seems like a nice option. Another version of it is to let your shins rest against the wall or a chair/couch so you don’t have to continually use your hands. There is no “right” way to do these poses, but there are many wrong ways! How does it feel: during, coming out and afterwards? If there is no pain or discomfort even the next day, it seems okay to me.

#2: Bow Pose? If you can’t do Sphinx without your chin on the floor, why are you considering Bow Pose? That is much more dynamic and dangerous for your back. If you can’t do Sphinx don’t go for Bow pose yet. Better would be to do a Bridge pose: roll onto your back, knees bent, feet on the floor, and lift your hips enough to but a block or bolster under your hips (not under your lower back!) and rest on the block. If available, slowly walk the feet further away. Another option: arms overhead. When done, walk you feet back in, lift your hips just enough to move the block away and slowly lower down and rest.

#3: It is natural to feel the hips lift up with the knees are bent. This is a function of your anatomy: the rectus femoris attaches to the front of the pelvis and when it is stretched (which is what happens when you bend your knees) it tends to create an anterior tilt to the pelvis, which lifts your butt up. This is okay, in fact this anterior pelvic tilt is what creates the deeper arch in the lumbar spine. Don’t put more weight on your hips! You keep wanting to make things harder! (More weight, Bow Pose, …etc.) This is yin! Do less! Be patient.

Cheers
Bernie

[YogiBalance]

Yes, i meant bending the knees inside sphinx pose like you suggest in the asana page and will implement your suggestions. I'm becoming more and more aware of "less is more" approach and make it a part my practice. I will be more aware if i feel unpleasant sensations right after/a day after and figure out if there is a pose i'm doing wrong or overdoing.
Should i not feel any pain after the practice or even a day after the practice even when i have scoliosis and sciatica? In other words, are there certain health conditions that will always trigger a pain during and after a yoga practice?
All in all, after i started to implement yin in my practice i feel big improvement in my flexibility, relaxation, stability and decreased pain but i still feel some small pain and electrical sensation close to my right hip. I'm trying to figure out how to eliminate these.

[Bernie]

Are there some conditions that can trigger pain? Probably. There are, unfortunately, some people for whom life is painful, all the time. But, I don't think you fall in that category. Just keep paying attention and become your own teacher/doctor.

[YogiBalance]

I understand, (edited my post after your already replied, not sure if you read it or not so i will elaborate: One of my priorities in my practice is to reduce or even eliminate the pain and electrical sensation i feel due to scoliosis and sciatica. I already feel big improvement as i wrote. I hope that as my awareness, knowledge and practice progresses they will be further reduced or eliminated.

[YogiBalance]

1. When doing the saddle pose sometimes my right knee feels restricted (as if there is some stubborn bone or muscle inside that won't move to where it should, it feels stuck in place) and sends unpleasant restricting pressure. There is no prob with my left knee. I tried to loosen the knee by moving the leg back and fourth but it does not seem to help. Other times when i sit for saddle the right knee is not restricted but i don't know what is causing it. Why does this restriction happen and how do i loosen up the right leg/knee to prevent it from happening? Are there some preliminary poses/preparation for frustration free saddle pose? Its really annoying... Its not the first time the right knee is restricting when trying to flex the leg, it happens occasionally for years.
2. Are there yin yoga poses that work on the glutes and abdominal muscles?

[Bernie]

1) where is the feeling in the knee? The top of the knee, the inside, outside or back of the knee? Sometimes a stuck feeling can come from a slightly torn meniscus that gets caught when the knee flexes, or from the knee cap not tracking properly. Resetting the knee by straightening it a few times could help, but if the knee is also slightly inflamed, you may have to wait for that to go away. Since this has been happening for years, it would be goodt is to ask your doctor/physio to sense the catch points by testing you.

2) when you say “work” what do you mean? Work sounds yang. We don’t strengthen the muscles in yin yoga, but we can stress them: Shoelace especially with a forward fold, Sleeping Pigeon, Dragons, can all stress the glutes. Backbends like Saddle or supported Bridge, especially with arms over head can stress the abdominals, as do twists.

[YogiBalance]

1. The feeling is from the inside of the knee i think. Generally, my right leg and hip seem the be the weaker parts. My sciatica also radiates to the right side. If i go too far in a pose usually my right leg/hip are the parts that send the message. I will try to straighten the knee a few times when it happens again and see how it goes. That is definitely something i ask my doctor next time i see him, i did not think of that until now.
2. By work i mean stress. Currently the only sitting on the butt pose my body allows me to do with forward bend pain free is when sitting on a stool - like caterpillar but with bent legs. Can supported bridge be practiced as a yin pose?